Climate Catastrophe: A Correspondence between the Entrenched Right and Bitter Left
Thursday, September 18th, 2008 (Events)
Hi Folks:
Here is an exchange I had with the COO of a right-wing think tank that promotes “free markets” and negates climate change. It’s a compelling read. I am not sure if the time spent made an impact. According to NY Times article citing psychological research on politics and climate change, humans tend to want to reinforce existing world views when seeking out information rather than collecting data that makes them insecure.
Richard W. Walker wrote:
Thanks for your kind words about my children (not joking!). Just don’t agree about global warming; agree about climate change–it’s with us, as it always has been, and it’s always been violent. To me, evidence shows that mitigation not prevention is the best solution. Do agree about the need to shift to alternative energy, if only for energy security, just think the evidence shows that when free markets are allowed to work new, more efficient technologies will come to the fore. But much good luck to you.
Richard W. Walker
COO, NCPA
Marc Dreyfors (President, The Forest Foundation) wrote:
My Apologies Richard if I annoyed you.
What I hoped more than that is put fear in your heart (a “Rovian” technique), as your actions put fear in mine that we will not solve anything under the ideology you espouse, but dig ourselves deeper in a hole that will enslave our children to a world deprived of basic rights and resources. Energy security, environmental protection and sustainable development go hand in hand. What is energy security? Burning more fossil fuels? That is self destruction on the highest order. If these ideas are so annoying, publish them to your constituency. I am sure they would love the red meat. If you think you are right, argue the point.
Read Collapse by Jared Diamond. That’s where we are headed thanks to bozos like the ones in your org. that think markets are free or climate change is a hoax. I have a whole list of books on our website, that I would highly recommend.
May your children be blessed with enlightenment(as it seems you may a ways to go).
Marc
Richard Walker wrote:
Mr. Dreyfors,
I’ve slightly reconsidered yesterday’s response to you. In light of our divergent views it’s obvious you’re wasting my time and yours. My conclusions about how we should respond to climate changes and energy security (which is a far graver matter) have been arrived at only after careful research and much thought, as I hope yours have. So I would humbly suggest that you expound these views through editorials to local and even national newspapers and blogs–the NRDC, for example, would likely welcome you heartily. That would be a far more productive endeavor for you and a much less annoying one for me.
Richard W. Walker
Chief Operating Officer
NCPA
(972) 308-6483
Marc Dreyfors (President, The Forest Foundation) wrote:
Dear Mr. Walker,
I was trained by some of the best scientists in some of the best
educational systems on the planet. I have published scientific work in
reputable journals and had my work peer reviewed. Have you?
Richard Walker wrote:
Mr. Dreyfors,
Thank you for your views about the Earth and the threats you perceive
to its ecosystem. From the repeated emails you send us, we are by now
well aware of your views and how much you misunderstand ours. So let
me state some things clearly so you can quit this foolish endeavor
(sorry, but true) and engage in more productive pursuits. While there
has been some warming of the Earth in the past, the global warming
campaign is just that: a campaign; it’s not science.
Bull shit. Science elicits facts. The facts are: humans are destroying
this planet in so many ways we can’t keep up documenting the losses,
over population and unsustainable resource consumption are the main
culprits.
The research simply doesn’t bear it out; there’s even research that
the Earth has cooled somewhat recently.
Are you really that uneducated…. global dimming from particulates in
the atmosphere from fossil fuel consumption and La Nina cause cooling–
the Earth fluctuates!? Systems cycle, they are dynamic, oscillate, but
the trend is towards global scorching as methane deposits are released,
but equally probable is a severe climate shift to an ice age if we tip
the balance. We have no idea of the catastrophe that we push this planet
towards as feedback loops are largely unknown. What we do know is that
the last 10,000 years has been a period of incredible climate stasis,
which we are irreparably damaging.
But even if warming does exist, we cannot just stop our economies
without wreaking havoc on billions of innocent people. Mitigation is a
far better course.
This is an example of your organizations fallacious arg. “we can’t just
stop our economies,” that says nothing about myriad things we can do to
grow our our economies while internalizing market externalities that
abound. Our economies will collapse if we do nothing to stop fossil fuel
consumption, now.
Of course, the Russians have now managed to accomplish what a decade
of sober research could not-kill Kyoto. We are not sick, and we are
not stuck in an old paradigm. We believe in free markets because
wherever they’ve been given a chance to work economies, and people,
flourish. Free economies provide opportunity. We promote free
economies, not any particular energy source or technology. We are
energy neutral. So our stance is that given the urgent need for energy
security, we should let free markets decide which technologies are the
most efficient and therefore most socially and economically beneficial
for all people, not just those with vested interests in select
alternative solutions.
You are obviously not an economist, as there is no such thing as a free
market as some ideal. “Free”? Your free markets are dominated by
monopolies, free riders, capture, corporate manipulation, market
externalities, etc., etc. Your Adam Smith ideal has nothing to do with
reality. You are dreaming. Using “market forces” to correct the raping
and pillaging of our society and natural world is one of many strategies
that makes sense, that we can agree. The markets “left to their own
devises,” reap misery, hardship and destruction if unregulated and not
guided by a value system that is well grounded in care and compassion
for others and the world around us. Markets poorly reflect
overpopulation and overconsumption, nor price them accordingly. Markets
do not value biodiversity loss, or climate change– massive market
failures.
Your social Darwinian approach is shortsighted and evil. We as humans
can do better. You, as an advocate of “market approaches,” should be
better educated on the problems and absurdity of “free” markets. There
is nothing free in the world. You should go back to school and take some
courses on physics and ecology and learn that there are no free rides,
and that randomness and chaos even have structure, entropy permeates
everything and energy and waste have serious costs, not reflected in our
markets. Everything is determined by the laws of physics and ecology,
genetics, etc. Your pursuit of freedom is an illusion of perception.
I would be glad to help educate you and your colleagues as it seems your
logic is oxymoronic, easily proven false and faulty. It is sad to see
money being spent on your organization when you proselyte such
disinformation. Again, those who conspire to undermine efforts to save
our planet when the science is unequivocal will be tried for crimes
against humanity. Mark my words, when millions begin to suffer and die
due to failure to act– your markets not responding, you will be called
to answer for your actions. You are promoting a corporate world view
that thrives on status quo, lack of innovation and old paradigms. You
really need to find the spirit of compassion, as your markets won’t.
Marc Dreyfors
President,
The Forest Foundation, Inc.
For example, perhaps I’m wrong about this, but it appears that you
would benefit greatly from the adoption of select alternative energy
solutions since you have intimate professional and private
associations (see those listed in your email) with companies and
organizations that will benefit greatly if free markets are not
allowed to work out the solutions to our energy problems. In fact, it
appears that your private associations may even have been undertaken
solely to strengthen your professional ones. I notice, for example,
that the Boy Scouts, the United Way and Little League baseball are
missing from your credentials. So is your opposition to free markets
grounded only in your own self-interest (careful, you may be making
Adam Smith’s point for him) or to the benefit of all citizens of the
Earth? If your diatribes against free markets and the NCPA are helping
lower your blood pressure or keeping you from kicking the dog, we’re
happy to have made that contribution to society. But if you’re trying
to dissuade us from our free market views I’m afraid that will be a
harder row to hoe, as they say in Durham and other points Southern,
than you’re capable of plowing.
Richard W. Walker
Chief Operating Officer
National Center for Policy Analysis (NCPA)
12770 Coit Rd., Suite 800
Dallas, Texas 75251
(972) 308-6483
richard.walker@ncpa.org <mailto:richard.walker@ncpa.org> (preferred)
/The NCPA is a 501(c)(3) nonprofit, nonpartisan public policy research
organization headquartered in //Dallas with offices in Washington,
D.C. The NCPA depends solely on the contributions of individuals,
corporations and foundations that advocate private sector solutions to
public policy problems. All contributions are tax-deductible, and the
NCPA accepts no government grants or contracts./
ORIGINAL Message
From: marc [mailto:marc@theforestfoundation.org]
Posted At: Wednesday, August 20, 2008 10:48 AM Posted To: Events
Conversation: Sick bastards, sick planet
Subject: Sick bastards, sick planet
Dear Friends:
You and your organization are a reflection of the illness, the cancer,
the disease that has permeated our culture and that is now reflected
in the health of our planet. We, ourselves and the the planet, are
sick, and you are causing the sickness to get worse, by ignoring it
and living and thinking in an old paradigm. You fail to see the
destructive nature of your actions and your way of thinking. It is
flawed, logically, philosophically and spiritually. I pray that you
will come around and see the madness in your world view.
You must stop promoting the destruction of our planet, as we humans,
need it along with countless species to survive. Your efforts to
undermine action on climate and environment is making things much
worse, and rise to crimes against humanity as millions, indeed
hundreds of millions may die because of your inaction and your efforts
to undermine the actions of others.
Your arguments are fallacious and here are but a few: First, the Earth
is primary, we are secondary. Second, markets are not free,
corporations do not work in our public trust, and thus the role of
public policy and government. Third, markets are full of failures, of
which the market externality of pollution is the greatest failure in
human history.
Finally, humans are fatally mis-perceiving the world around them, as
we are all connected by natural ecosystem cycles and your actions and
lifestyle affect me.
Stop you destructive behavior!
Marc Dreyfors (MEM ‘90)
Manager,
Manager,
www.CarolinaBiofuels.com
President,
www.TheForestFoundation.org
Manager,
Board Member,
Env. Educators of NC (2005-07)
Alumni Council,
Nicholas School at Duke University (2005-10)
1505 Angier Ave.
Durham, NC 27701
(919)957.1500